By 1970’s Gooner
When will Wenger learn that making players play out of position will inevitably result in mistakes being made?
Just like Toure’s inability to deal with Babel giving that crucial penalty away.
When will Wenger learn that Senderos is an accident to happen?
In fact he had two accidents; one to let Hyppia have a free header and the other being so far away from the danger called Torres. And by deciding to playing Senderos Wenger had to move Toure to right back (see previous paragraph).
When will Wenger learn that Gilberto is not up to it now?
And that Song is a far better sub for Flamini?
When will Wenger learn that Eboue is not a winger ?
And that he is prone to pass the ball to the opposition and make the wrong decisions? Just like when all he had to do was to just cut the ball back to the unmarked Adebayor.
When will Wenger learn that width is very important?
Especially against teams that compress the space. It wasn't until Walcott came on and set up that goal for Adebayor that we had penetration from the wing (unlike Eboue before- see previous paragraph).
When will Wenger learn that Walcott is dynamite that can win you games as early as the first half?
Walcott could have exploded this game away from Liverpool if he had started.
Posts
99 comments:
walcott done more in 5 mins that eboue has done in 5 games
get that red and white shirt off and go elsewhere
What are you ranting about?
We should have had a penalty in the first leg. Babel claims he was pulled back for the penalty in tonight's game. It simply didn't happen. We were cheated. It happens. Don't turn on Wenger. You're like a spoilt child with a limited understanding of football.
The team was good enough. The performance was good enough. Over two legs the officials were poor.
That's not Wenger's fault.
I think I'm going to cry! I am so fucking pissed off at giving away a penalty so soon after scoring...damn this defeat hurts. Was in my local just near the emirates and we were all so happy when Walcott produced his magic setting up the goal...never been more depressed when the penalty went in. Football is so so cruel. I agree with all your points in the article...Wenger needs to understand how much the fans are hurting now
Yeah.
We were hard done by over 2 legs by refereeing decisions. That has been our season. A shame really.
Absolutely f*ckin devestated mate...
Eboue is a c*nt.
Blame Senderos but for the second goal, the ball seemed to go through Toure to Torres.
Toure has been poo since the ACN. I think his long lost twin brother has him held hostage in Africa and has come to impersonate him and live the high life.
Adebayor? Did f all apart from the easy tap in.
Diaby started bright and then did f all.
What a team of poo.
If a number of the shocking decisions that have gone us in the CL and the league never happened, you would be lauding Wenger and the squad. Go look at yourself in the mirror you plastic.
I agree with the comments above - we were good enough over the 2 legs but the refs were poor. time to punish them and bring in video refereeing - enough is enough!
I think there is a lot of truth in the points made in the article. Senderos is not quality, Eboue is crap and Toure gave the penalty away.
What are you talking about, once again the Arsenal were robbed by two terrible refereeing decisions. Liver played well and rode their luck but for me and without bias, the Arsenal were the better team over the two legs and do not deserve to go out this way. I, for one am truly proud of my team, Up the mighty Arsenal.
IM STILL PROUD TO BE A GUNNER!!!!
Though I agree with a few things......
a) Eboue should be a backup RB and that it!!
b) Wenger needs to just TRUST THEO AND START HIM
c) We need to buy some wingers
d) Gilbertos run as a GUNNER is sadly over
IM NOT TURNING MY BACK ON WENGER!!! BUT I HOPE HE REALISES THE ABOVE!!!!
this is what you get when you are stubborn enough to play central players on the wing and fullbacks
only one person is to blame for that and it isnt the ref or the press
Liver-poo (spelling mistake on purpose) spend the money for a proven finisher and they progress in the CL, its about time wenger started spending the high ticket price cash that we keep having to give the club, how many more times can we keep saying our kids have got another years experience, its just not good enough, we as loyal paying fans deserve a chance to celebrate once again. +++Walcott must start every game left this season as Eboue looks slow and uninterested this year+++
I'm far away to tell wanger what to do because he is the man on board but his team was not that intresting and this is since a while now, 7 games either on the champs league or so where negatives, he must have invested more during januarys transfers and I hope this will be a lesson,tactically that was a tuff game when you play a team which closes the game on you in an other side that was a good phisical liverpool team,
no point to be ungry, more important games coming and lets hope we wont drop two, three or more places in the Championship.
Wanger, you need to rethink about bringing a solid boys but not kids.
Asenal till I Die.
Moo
So many silly comments here.
Liverpool won because Benitez spent 27M? well our striker scored too.
We lost because Toure played right back? Dude are you stupid or what?
But our silly defence can't hold an advantage.
If this is the way our defence will be. We'll never ever win anything.
I think everyone's giving Senderos too much of a kicking. He lacks pace, but reads the game better than Toure all day long. He was definitely at fault for their first goal, but Toure cocked up on the second and the 'so-called' penalty. He still reminds me of a young Tony Adams and I think he will become a good defender. The problem nowadays is that the stakes are so high that any errors are magnified beyond all belief.
Eboue is not fir to wear the shirt and if Wenger did not recognise that tonight and that Theo has come of age, then he never will.
I would have played Bendtner before Adebayor, because Ade seems to believe that he is better than he actually is.
For me, the game was actually lost when Flamini had to be taken off. Liverpool had the run of the midfield then.
I am disappointed. No, GUTTED! However, that is football for you. We've suffered before and we'll suffer again, but we have had sweet success before and it will come again.
For me, the key is for Wenger to attempt to emulate some of the qualities of the 97/98 squad. A mixture of veteran intelligence and brilliant youth.
Gooner for life!
can't go on blaming the ref's - senderos was on the spot in both hyppia and torres' goals - too slow to react, in fact torres got his chance when toure no longer checked him it's very sad that wenger errs not only on the tactical level within the match but these mistakes only [point out the strategic level failure (u can't win titles with a thin squad,not bringing into consideration season-long injuries of pivotal players or gradually burning-out of tiredness of others - not having adequate replacements for them ,with only one 20 goals striker' - and who brought us down today and last week - kuyt, torres and babel all arsenal targets in the past
Senderos could have prevented the goal in the first leg. Today he basically gave Torres a penalty shot. This is so disappointing.
to anonymous at 10:47, rafa also spent money on sktel, who is good cover for his defence, who do we have "DUDE" the great hoyte, wenger hasnt got the depth needed to compete in all competitions, were lucky were in the league position we are. And regarding our striker scored to comment, he only did that thanks to walcott taking some responsibility and actually running towards there penalty area which van persie was right behind in case he slipped up with the finish, at times we moved to slow. It would have been a different game altogether if flamini had stayed on but enough of us all moaning to each other, lets get behind the boys and help them finish this season with there heads up. Hope to see Gooner50 and Vanthevan at Old Trafford, lets make some noise for the boys!!!!!
Wenger will have to dismantle his defence.Big Phil you have been great but you are never gonna be the new Adams.We Need an Esiien type player in midfield,we need wingers that will score an not try endless passes.Toure and Gallas simply isnt working.....Toure has been shocking of late.....could he be moved in to midfield as an enforcer ?????
watch all the highlights and goals here
http://srohit.blogspot.com/2008/04/liverpool-v-arsenal-ucl-2nd-leg.html
u can also download the entire match
To danish gooner: Rather than 'dismantle' the defence, I think it's to 'build' one. I like your idea about Toure!
Morons at large. A penalty decided this game. Mr Skrtel who was bought conceded 2 goals tonight, and should be grateful to be on the winning side.
Why can't we keep a FUCKING LEAD?
morons at large wtf?, our teams loses and we start moaning at our own fans, this is a forum for gooners, try and keep criticism to opposing fans
I agree about Gilberto being over for Arsenal (shame he was great)... Eboue gave a good performance first half compared to recent games but he is too inconsistent..Walcott will be a legend for Arsenal, if he gets the chance and doesn't get pissed off and leave...No way a penalty if you apply the same rules they used with Kuyt last week...There have been other factors in our demise this season but you can't help but feel referees poor decisions have magnified our errors (Cliche @ Birmingham & Last week especially)...Sick to the core but can't blame it all on Wenger, injuries, poor play, poor decsions from Refs and maybe a couple from Wenger but the good still outweighs the bad. If not Wenger who else for Arsenal?
Look fellow gooners, I'm livid with the refs too, but we have to look at our performances and also recent league form to see where we're going wrong. If we had a penalty at the Emirates and won 2-1 its quite likely that Liverpool would have scored first at Anfield with their 12th man and determined fighting spirit.
I say that because thats the kind of team Liverpool are. We held a lead for 3 mins in the first game, we held a lead for around 10 mins tonight and then later in the game held on to our away goal for maybe another 3 mins.
On a lighter more positive note, I thought Walcott was fantastic tonight and I agree that he should start every game from now on.
I used to defend Eboue as much as I could, but he is just a squad player as is Diaby, I'd also go as far to say that Rosicky and Van Persie are squad players due to the injuries.
I personally like Arsenes way, not spending big, just play Vela and give Barazite as many games as possible next season and let song fill in for flamster.
On Senderos he has shown some good form of late and pairs well with Gallas, I think Gallas prefers to partner Senderos than Toure, but tonight he was at fault and confirmed for me that he's really heavy footed and slow to react.
As for Toure, I just think he is knackered, and did quite well down the right tonight going forward, but defensively he's not been himself since ANC. Missing Sags.
Adebayor misses some right sitters at times and it does make me question him, his first touch is terrible, but I'm just hoping that he'll be even better next season.
Gilberto, he knows its curtains!
Arsenal were clearly hard done by with the descisions over the 2 legs. Whether this is just some of their infamous "bad luck" or a UEFA fix it's still irrelevant. Arsenal could have won this game regardless. Eboue is incapable at the right wing position. He is a decent attacking right-back and that is where he should have been playing. Toure struggles there, something obvious from the first leg. Senderos has had some good games this season but a centre-back requires consistency, something he definitely lacks. Toure should have been playing centre-back (although a big lump like Adams/Campbell would be more ideal). With Walcott playing right wing Arsenal probably would have won it in the 1st half. The boy is dynamite now and could have clearly torn Liverpool apart. Wenger is stubborn...it's not that he doesn't learn from his mistakes, he actually refuses to accept they're mistakes at all. I also think that after watching his ACN display Song would have been a much better sub for Flamini than Gilberto.
People say Arsenal are on the up but I don't see it. Eduardo might never be a class player again, Van Persie is injured too often as is Rosicky. Hleb and Flamini both might be leaving (Hleb because he wants to and Flamini because he wants more money). Hoyte is not a good enough right-back understudy and Eboue won't play understudy...he definitely should not be playing right wing though. Almunia is not good enough as a number 2 let alone a number 1 and currently there is no substitute for Fabregas who is tired from all his games and his studying (he wants to go to University). Add this to the fact that Adebayor is not a world class striker, more of an upfront man mountain with enourmous limbs and it adds up to a small squad in severe distress. No-one likes Bendtner either so he's probably on the way out (even if he is a potential super-star).
Arsenal need a top class keeper, a top class STRIKER, left-footed and right-footed goal scoring, pacey wingers, a big, aerial, domineering centre-back and a decent reserve right-back. If Denilson isn't up to the job he needs a reserve creative midfielder and if Song isn't up to the job he needs a reserve anchorman...and this is just assuming that Bendtner, Gilberto, Lehmann, Eboue and Hoyte leave (all very likely, I just wish Senderos would be off too). If Flamini and Hleb go there's even more trouble.
All of this would cost way, way, way more than Wenger will spend even if the money is available. I think Arsenal's season next year will be worse than this one not better unless AW shocks the world and changes his policy He needs a bigger squad and fast. This will destroy the chances of emerging players so he won't want to do it. Jose was right, there is no other club in the world who would not be putting pressure on Wenger now. Either Wenger has to wake up or the board do...4 years without a trophy would be a disgrace for the second biggest club in England...
and also...Senderos is a far better player now than at the begining of the season, can't believe he is getting so much stick, he's a great back up and I am sure he will be the real deal sooner rather than later.
this turning on wenger is ridiculus I think people need to start seeing the wood from the trees. Arsenal were despeatlely unlucky over the two legs and played the better of the two teams in the 120 mins. The major refereeing decisions went the way of Liverpool, a host of injuries(Rosicky Sagna=no Senderos tonight,Eduardo and Flamini)and a freakish goal line clearance by bendtner in the 1st leg added to their misfortune. The team needs a little bit of tweaking but not much, Center Half , Winger and Centre Midfielder will pobably be bought in the Summer and that will allow Arsenal to compete in a more sustained way next season
Don't know if Walcott should have started, but it seems to me an earlier substitution was in order. It was as if Arsenal's dominance ran out after the half, and the scousers picked it up. The loss of Flam was huge - midfield just looked barely there, but Alex was falling back and trying. When Theo started that run, I said to myself, "Arsenal are streaming forward now" and suddenly it was in the net.
But then the "penalty". Am I right in saying Kolo barely touched him? I can't see it. But then the wheels came off. Still, what a wonderful match. Arsenal just biding their time for world domination (and loosening the purse strings this summer wouldn't hurt, Mr Wenger. I know you know... but, you know?)
2 or 3 seasons ago arse vs spurs.....arse win 3-1...second goal was clearly off side an third goal was a penalty that arse players dived......so dont give us this shit now about oh the refree
2 or 3 seasons ago arse vs spurs.....arse win 3-1...second goal was clearly off side an third goal was a penalty that arse players dived......so dont give us this shit now about oh the refree
Bollocks. Messed it up again.
Shit defending costs us against decent teams. We won't win anything if we can't hold a lead.
And for all the "we were unlucky" brigade, wake up, if we are consistently unlucky every game then it's not luck, it's the way we play.
I am sick and tired of listening, reading 'stuff' from this teams so called fans - those same fans that thought Arsene was just'magic' when we won the double...
No-one thought we would do this well, and all but S**T refs, we would have done so much better...
Eboue was not that bad, not ubtil the second half, but yes he should be sold, as should some others...
But, either support this club, and remain loyal and positive, or PISS OFF and support Bolton, Spurs, West Ham... I dont care, but stop being so negative.
The boss said we had inexperience at the back, maybe he has learned also... he IS ONLY HUMAN!!!!!
Me - I will be cheering Man Utd now to win, or even Barca for Titi, at least they both entertain
....if Diaby can't deputise for Flamini and is playing out of position on the left wing, then where the hell does he fit in this team. I'd rather have him or Song there than Gilberto. It took us a good 10+ mins to get our game going again.
Really gutted with the result, i agree the ref was poor but if Adebayor took his chances, it would of changed the whole atmosphere of the tie.
Really Iam very upset,Arsenal deserve to win this game.Wenger must buy new and good players,Eboue became a crap,Adebayor his first touche in ball is a disaster,please Wenger we need a change,we have many players don't deserve to be there,anyway we are gunner till we die.
Oh what a game,ref was a rubish.
next season will be bether.
How important is it that Diarra ddnt have the patience to wait. He was missed since january and that isnt AW's fault. Senderos has been excellent recently, he made a mistake but so do our star forwards, defenders just ussually get punished more. Ade missed a sitter. By and large I thought we played well enough to win and werer robbed by two dubious decisions. My only complaint is Theo was on the pitch fro 10 minutes and I dont remember anyone passing to him. The attacks all came down the left. In the end he had to get the ball himself. Lets use his pace more!!!
Its amazing that a soft pull back at the cop is a penalty but a blatant drag down at the Emirates is not. As an Arsenal fan I can only feel cheated. Where is the justice. I mean fuck, i don't care, give a penalty but only if you fucken well give it to both teams. NO ONE can argue that babels was a penalty but Hlebs wasnt. Wenger shouldn't have played eboue, walcott should have started. But anyway, seasons over, as long as long ball Chelsea doesn't win anything I'm happy.
lots i disagree with,
wenger got it right, we played well and were fucked by a shit decision, again,
http://anotherarsenalblog.blogspot.com/2008/04/tale-of-two-penalties.html
Uefa shd make refs accountable for their decisons. those who make glaring blunders shd be severely punished where it hurts in the poackets. Too many of these guys are getting away with murder.
Here f*cking here. I was yelling at the TV for them to move the ball to the right so Walcott could use his pace rather than exhaust the Hleb/Clichy pairing that was routinely being cut out.
But I think Wenger's done after this year.
Come on you people. We can't just blame it on the referee like some crying bitches. We did not play good, especially in the second half today we were awful. Sure the Hleb incident was an obvious penalty and you really have to question that ref. He was 25 feet away, which is about the distance from his house to Kuyt's house. That might explain a lot.
But we have to blame this on ourself. I would say that the performance of Senderos and Toure was what made the difference. We scored our goals by sensational play, Liverpool scored because of sttupid mistakes by our defenders. Last week Toure was absolutely at fault. Senderos gave up two goals with his terrifying agility and then Toure gave away a penalty. Think what you want about the decision but that was a very slobby challenge. I actually think Fabregas should have been the fouling player as he started it outside the box.
I agree that Wenger has to make some changes from his usual team selection. Eboue is the most useless player there has ever been but still he plays. He has 1 assists, 0 goals. Walcott has 5 goals and I can't count how many assists. If Eboue starts against Man U then I will be mad. I will be mad at Eboue for being a headless chicken, I will be mad at Wenger for choosing a headless chicken and I will be mad at Pat Rice for not stopping Wenger from doing this awful mistake.
Walcott has a future, a really great future. Was there anybody else that saw a resemblence between his run today and Owen's goal against Argentina in '98? Owen was 19 then, Walcott is 19. Theo is the man and he deserves to be a starter in this team. I think that by the beginning of 2009, both Vela and Walcott will be permanent starters at Arsenal.
Finally, I have a list:
Players who need to go without even finding a replacement first: Eboue, Eboue, Eboue, Hoyte, Lehman, Gilberto (we have Song)
Players that we should find a replacement for: Diaby
Players we should not count as squad members, due to their inability to keep fit: Rosicky, RvP
Position we need to strenghten: Centre Back - We need a Senderos, just somebody who doesn't let a 75 year old Finnish defender turn him around.
Winger/Striker: Vela, Walcott, Ade, Nicklas, RvP, Rosicky, Dudu, Hleb. Those are 8 which sounds good. But RvP, Rosicky and Dudu will be injured most of the season so we only have 5 players for those 4 position. That means that we need a new player. Bring in Quaresma or someone in that mould. Robinho would be just what we need. Something need to be done because we will have injuries.
Somebody to compete with Fabregas: Does he trust Merida? Does he trust Denilson? If so, then we are good. If Wenger does not believe that we can win games with either of them playing instead of Fabregas, then we need a new playmaker. That wonderkid from Metz sounds good but will Wenger trust him? We can't expect some Kaka like player to sit on the bench most of the season so we need a young player or some not as good right aged player. But one thing is for sure, we will have to rest Cesc more then we did this season. We can't expect a then 21 year old to play 60 games with the burden of the whole team on his shoulders. Either trust your younger players or buy somebody.
Seriously everyone needs to stop with this penalty rubbish. Yes, I know that it seems we get a questionable decision against us every other game but to be perfectly honest the only reason we make such a big deal of it is because we are never comfortable enough or clinical enough to allow room for such errors from the ref and indeed from our own.
What worries me about this team is that it seems to battle in every game as if it were a champions league final. Honestly, what was the last routine win we had in which we've finished the match in the first half? Come on people, don't be losers. This is what you're all acting like to be perfectly honest. Those of you who accept the defeat are pathetic and those of you who blame decisions are just plain ignorant.
Bad decisions occur in every match but if you have the sufficient quality you can overcome these obstacles just like if you have a large and talented enough squad you brush over injuries.
Arsene Wenger is really pushing it. Yes the team is improving organically but what he seems to fail to realize is that other teams around us, with the help of funds and influx of quality players, are also improving.
Liverpool, Man Utd and Chelsea all finished above us last season and they brought in Torres, Tevez and Anelka respectively.
This is getting ridiculous. Wenger chooses to tie his feet before a race then claim he still did well by hopping till the finishing line but it doesn't hide the fact that he is left in the dust by his opponents. He needs to re-assess the strengths and weakness of his team and decide who the best players are to solve these problems. Benzema, Eto'o, Villa and Ribery all come to mind but I don't make the decisions. But I swear to God, if he even bids for Ben Arfa I will hunt him down and shove his tie down his throat.
Walcott needs to play some of the remaining games as a striker. That piece of individual quality earned him the right to prove himself in his favoured position.
We need to jump up a couple of levels this summer if we are to even begin to accomplish what Wenger claims this group of players promise. But what do I know? I mean Wenger knows.... Right???
P.S. Another good post 1970's gooner. But the answer is unfortunately no. Wenger will never learn. He is stubborn in his beliefs. Converting players from central play-makers into narrow wingers and wingers into width orientated strikers makes Wenger sleep with a distinct sense of accomplishment at night.
Keep up the good work
Arsenal fans do not worry ....with some more siginings better luck and less injuries we would have won this game ...we still have to go to old trafford ...an united team with out its central defenders, no nani, so i say chill out this team is eloving once we win our first tropthy this season (it will be hard ) or def next the trophys will follow in abdundance...lastly arsene knows keep the faith
when will wenger learn that almunia is not a great goalkeeper.
does any one rememeber how liverpool win the corner?????????????????????
almunia mistake
and 4th goal almunia dont know where he is?????WTF
Present day notable goalkeepers include Petr Čech, Gianluigi Buffon, Iker Casillas, Oliver Kahn, Guillermo Ochoa, and Edwin van der Sar.
no almunia no lehmann ...and we expanded almunia contract NICE ARSENAL VERY NICE
FUCK OFF I AM BORING YOU ARSENAL
accident to happen is almunia
The defense is poor. It has been all season long, and the team has no confidence in holding a lead anymore.
Sort out the defense Wenger, sort it out NOW.
plastic fans on a plastic site.
any fan that doesn't feel more aggrieved by the non-existent penal than Wenger knows fuck all about football
Thanks Angelo for your comments.
Can you please contact me? Your comment deserves to be published.
Again it's the long ball which is the undoing of Arsenal.This type of tactics is repugnant to AW. He prefers football played to feet.
Torres was given time and space and I have for a long time have not much faith in Senderos due to his lack of pace.The same goes for Kolo.
I'm afraid although we can blame the penalties for the loss,we have to look at the defence.
AW blames the lack of experience and he has himself to blame for not buying experience in Jan.
Gilberto did alright mate. The one glaring stat from this tie is that we had the lead 3 times, once for 3 minutes, once for 17 minutes and once for 30 seconds. If that doesn't tell Wenger anything then I'm afraid nothing will.
Also, recently he said that losing Eduardo was the turning point, if he'd have known he'd be without Rosicky, Van Persie and Eduardo he'd have strengthened in January. I couldn't believe that, Rosicky and VanPersie, players who regularly miss half a season, were actually injured in January. So is Wenger basically saying that he knew in January that one injury would totally derail our season?
listen i dont think you can blame wenger for anything, he did magic with what he had. if we werent at anfield we would have killed them.so lay off the boss! he is king!
Knockout in a cup competition isn't license for wholesale changes to the playing staff. Neither is being in contention for the league until Late March/Early April (although a win this weekend would make the next few weeks a bit tasty).
Great effort from the lads very proud just wasn't our night, we'll come back stronger.
Plain and simple ... Compared with what everyone thought happen at the start of the season, Arsenal have massively overachieved.
We've had the rest of the league chasing our tail for 75% of the season, we've spent very little money, esp. when you think about the money Chelsea, Man Utd, Liverpool and Tottenham has spent, and in all fairness, we've done really well. Why? Because of Arsene Wenger.
Think about the squad that was out yesterday, both Sagna and Eduardo were missing yesterday. So the two players we did sign this season didn't feature. Yet, we ran Liverpool ragged over two legs, and only dodgy refereeing made the difference.
Granted, Senderos showed yet again that he needs to be replaced, as he should've been touch tight to both Hyypia and Torres for the goals. Adebayor needed to show a little more composure - he had the time to take a touch. But still, that aside silverware or none this year, no matter.
So Wenger hasn't delivered silverware in three seasons. So what? Is that really a crisis? I think not!! We have been there or there abouts. He got us to the Champions League final, remember dodgy ref again sending Lehmann off that early in the game. We've lost our Talisman Thierry Henry, who is now apparently up for sale again. Who else has left, Pires, Ljungberg, Bergkamp, Edu ... and we're still top four. Why ... Arsene Wenger.
Like all work in progress, there are some tweaks needed. Ben Arfa would be a good addition plus another winger, a new Centre Back, an additional keeper, and maybe just maybe, a Torres-Esque forward. Fact remains, that the majority of the team is there now. They've shown fight, determination, steel, etc. qualities that were lacking in previous seasons. How? Because Wenger has instilled this belief in each and every one of them.
So you ask "When will Wenger Learn?". Fact is, he's learnt and is learning with every match, week, season ... and very shortly (possibly even next season) he will deliver everything and more, and everyone of the so-called fans, that keep whinging and turning on him will have to eat their words.
For the foundation he has created at our club, for what they have achieved so far, I am truly proud of Arsenal, and as I already said, remove the dodgy reffing decisions from the matches against Birmingham, Wigan, Liverpool, Chelsea, etc. you would never have written this post in the first place.
Keep going Arsene. Those of us worth our salt, see what you are doing with the club and wholeheartedly support you.
4 games played against Liverpool this season , for all that so called superior football of Arsenals they failed to win ANY of those 4 games. So much for superior football.
*waits for all the arsenal "yea buts" to come*
There have been many people complaining about our small squad, our lack of big name signings, our tactics but you know what it doesn't matter. We could have the largest squad in Europe we could have signed the top 10 players in the world we could have got all the master tacticians from around the world and for what ? For us to go out of Europe due to 2 obscene decisions by referee's not fit to wear their shirts. Our miniscule squad of no ego's were the better team over 180 minutes against Liverpool, the second half of the firstleg and in particular our first 30 minutes last night was as well as we have played all season. The stonewall penalty in the first leg was a blow but our team with 6 minutes left were in the semi final even after acknowledging Senderos had his worst game of 2008 the rest of the team had done enough until a Liverpool player falls over in the box, the Kop scream and the simple minded ref loses all sense of what actually happens gets over excited by the Kop that he awards a penalty and we are robbed of our rightful place in the CL semi final. And you wonder why Wenger blames the referee. The pundits are just as thick Jim Beglin
(ex Liverpool) was glad Babel scored a fourth because it would take dilute some of the grotesquely wrong penalty decision. Jim for your dim witted brain we would not have committed 10 players to the attack at 2-2 with 1 minute to go. Prat.
And to all those who thought our team would be too tired to compete which player covered the most ground last night ? Cesc who has played more games than anyone was the only player to travel more than 13,000 metres.
Finally lets just think of the point our league campaign went awry.
At Birmingham after the Eduardo horror they got a free kick because he fell over and a penalty that was not, 2 points robbed. Against Boro a perfectly good Adebayor goal ruled offside. Against Chelsea Drogba's equaliser when he was 2 yards offside. Liverpool, Saturday Cesc pulled back in the box no penalty 2 points robbed. These decision were all wrong but they are supposed to even themselves up over the season. Bollocks just poor refereeing by people who never played the game. If these decisions had not gone against us Manure may still have won the league but at least our players and our fans would have a chance for glory ourselves rather than being denied by officials not doing their job
The game is too big and the stakes too high to allow this obscenity to continue.
4 games played against Liverpool this season , for all that so called superior football of Arsenals they failed to win ANY of those 4 games. So much for superior football.
*waits for all the arsenal "yea buts" to come*
Facts are Facts. end of !
http://srohit.blogspot.com/2008/04/liverpool-v-arsenal-ucl-2nd-leg.html
amen
Ithink it's outrageous the results of the tie is due to a referee's error. Arsenal were not given a penalty at the ES and now have been suckered by a conniving ref who gives one to Liverpool.
UEFA shd use statistics to check on the performance of refs who decide the outcome of these high profile games running into millions of euros.
How do we know thse match officials don 't place bets on games they are officiating. A simple penalty,disallowed goal etc could come in handy.
Refs who get the big decsions wrong shd be sacked .Then we can be sure the rest will buck up.These guys think they are god and and can get away with glaring errors.
and liverpool only won one due to a dubious penalty decision...wow.. talk about outclassing us!
oh and just to help all you liverpool fans gloat, " Ref Pieter Vink has admitted to Arsenal boss Arsene Wenger he made a mistake in not awarding a penalty against Liverpool during last week's 1-1 Champions League draw"
I have alway believed that for Arsenal to win games/trophies they have to fight against twelve men one of is the ref. How do you know?
It is obvious in some of the pl games when penalties have been given friviously.
The other thing is AW concentrates his energy on attack just like Brzil. His attitude is to hell with the defence. Let me and my boys play bewitching soccer which sometimes runs into a stone wall and worse are suckered by the hit and run approach of teams like Boro,Bolton. to name a few.
I honestly believe AW must wake up and realise it's crazy passing all day. Teams hve learned to counter it. He must also adapt.
totally agree with "I think everyone's giving Senderos too much of a kicking. He lacks pace, but reads the game better than Toure all day long."
i have been harping on about Toure for several seasons, he had one fantastic year, his first at CB, and since then he has been a complete liability. His positioning is sh!te, his reading of the game is sh!te, more often than not Gallas bails him out, when he doesn't we concede. 75% of goals conceded are the fault of toure, we will never win the league or CL with him in the side. He reminds me Keown in his final years, he also used pace to cover his short-comings but he was a hell of a lot better in his prime.
Mathieu can Flamin go as well. Never available for a pass, can only pass backwards or to the oppo, both Diaby (who was/is a class player but lacks confidence and seems to be struggling after his injury) and Diarra are so far ahead of flamingo i makes me cry in despair as to why AW perseveres with him, i hope he has been playing him only to keep him in the shop window, as MF has nto yet signed a new contract. How much would it cost to buy all the Bics in north london ?
A few things. - How does Mascherano get away with it ?
What is it about Steve G that makes me feel ill, the massive ego, the false persona, the 'I'm the man' goal celebrations.
Finally, its clear now Wenger needs to sign two, high quality, top top class,world class, mature ref's to g'tee us a safe passage to silverware next term !
We were made by the media as the public enemy no.1 replacing Chelski since we don't have enough English players in our team. And now referees has something wrong against us.
Liverpool was extremely luck over 2legs. Even if our performance was not at our best, we still did enough beat Liverpool. Once again, the referee(man of the match) finish us off.
I personally think we should start using dirty tactics. Diving, malicious tackle of that sort. If we are not treated fairly on the pitch why should we behave. Bring Diaby on to kill Terry and Eboue on to break some legs.
I lost every ounce of respect for Liverpool. Gerrard is a fucking pussy cat and Benetiz can go home and fuck sheeps.
Without the help of referees, Liverpool should lost more than 6 points already. This just shows how fucking unfair it is. We should introduce some sort of compensation system. If a doggy decision significantly change the outcome of the match, the referee will have to bear all the economic losses of the suffering party.
Sell Eboue he's useless, sell Senderos another useless player. Start Walcott for fuck sake if Wenger won't start him for the way he's playing now i don't think he'll ever get to start.
I agree that song is a much better replacement for flamini and I was quite shocked when gilberto came on. Song has impressed me every time I've seen him play and I think he needs more games.
Walcott should have started, or at least came on at half time. I'm not doubting Wenger but we've let alot of good players go for no apparent reason and I just hope Theo won't be added to the list.
I don't know about senderos, he shows potential sometimes but doesn't seem reliable, I wouldnt start him in a champions league game at anfield.
I think we need a bit more rotation in midfield, because Cesc's played alot and we've got others who never get a game apart from in carling cup.
I really like the previous posters idea of performance related pay for ref's. Perhaps UEFA can meet with RiK Parry to discuss how Liverpool compensate theirs?
how can u say walcot was man of the match....he played for about 15 minutes. wat about hleb and fabregas who played their hearts out for 90.
eboue shouldnt be sold he played alright yesterday and he still has a place at arsenal. grow up and dnt turn on players after a bad result. if we had won and gone through would you be sayin this about eboue??? i doubt it.
about the efree decision.....FLASHBACK...2 or 3 seasons ago arse vs spurs…..arse win 3-1…second goal was clearly off side an third goal was a penalty that arse players dived……so dont give us this shit now about oh the refree
Every time Walcott has started he's been Rubbish. At this point Wenger is right to use him in the last third of games when defences are tired.
As usual, this site talks SHIT.
If it had stayed 2-2 which would have been fair, you would be writing about the brilliance of Walcott's substitution and Wenger's tactical genius.
You are a mug!
This is what Clichy has to say about yesterday's double capitulation.
"We did well to score the first goal and to come back and get the game to 2-2. And at that point we were through. But what happened after that was really disappointing.
"To concede a goal like this, whether it is a penalty or not a penalty, may be disappointing but it is not unlucky.
"It is unreal to have had a chance like this, to score the equaliser and get to 2-2 and then to concede a goal only a few seconds after kick off. I can't find the words for it. It is just ridiculous."
Ridiculous indeed.
I would love to 1970's gooner but I am not sure how to do so. If you could send me your e-mail address that would be great. Mine is angelos.k@hotmail.co.uk
Hope to hear from you soon.
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Oh and anonymous 1:45 I'm not sure if you recall but we didn't draw 2-2, we lost 4-2. I agree that Walcott plays better against defenders who have tired along the course of a match because it blunts the physical edge a 26-30 year old man has against an 18 year old teenager. But regardless, I noticed that the Liverpool midfield tired well before Walcott came on and more importantly so did ours. Walcott's substitution should have been made earlier, that is a fact which even you cannot deny. So spare me the should've, would've, could've rubbish. And stop spouting abuse at people for justifiable criticisms and opinions. Grow up
Angelo,
I have already sent you an e mail. I have also prepared your "article" for publication. All I need for you is to give me the ok to post it.
Also do you want to see it before I post it?
i was annoyed to see the team sheet with diaby n eboue. however we started amazing. both these guys were providing width, good passing n fluency. a terrible piece of play from almunia when gallas was telling him to let the ball go out lead to the first goal. senderos was poor. flamini going off changed alot of our discipline like with babel's run from kick off. the only bad decision was playing senderos. we should have played toure centre back with eboue right back n walcott in midfield. other than this wenger was tactically sound. when we scored in the 84th min, he was telling the players to calm down n hold the lead. they didnt. its not wengers fault. i will stick with my manager who's done so much n hope the team will learn and please us fans for our patience with alot of trophies next year
Yeah, if i could see it first that would be great. Thanks and the Van der Vaart situation has stalled because a Spanish offer still hasn't come in and Juventus are getting encouraging news from Diego's camp right now so have put Van der Vaart on hold. He wants to get all the offers in before he makes a decision, unlike last time when he was impatient to leave Ajax and settled for one of the first few offers to fall on the table.
to be honest how can wenger not take the blame for whats gone on in the past few months.any other manager in his position would be under intense pressure from the board.you can say we performed better than most of us gooners and the media had expected, but is it a really bad thing for me or any other gooners to have high expectations of the club.no silver wear in 4 seasons is not the sign of a club that is progressing. Wenger should be less stuborn and realise that investing so much time and effort into these youths isn't working.I'm sure wenger isn't stupid enough not 2 realise this and i'm sure he will invest in the summer.but the fact is the papers make us believe we have a vast amount of money to spend but only those who are on the board no exactly how much we have to spend so hopefully wenger spends it wisley.just a quick note on theo i really do feel for him, i'm sure if he had a french passport or an African pasport he would find himself in the side but why eboue is head of him we will never no, i used to tell myself its because he doesn't give the ball away as much as walcott does,but recent games have made me believe other wise.oh those of you pinning your hopes on a 19 yr old mexican kid next season would be very unfair on him.look at c ronaldo's 1 season in the premiership i no most if not all people were saying he's a 1 trick pony that can't shoot or cross the ball.look at him now.so vela needs time to settle nefore we expect results from him straight away.
Angelo I have to go out at the moment but I will e mail it to you in about an hour's time.
Thanks
You are all right but Eboue was also helping out in defence cos he supported Toure in a lot of cases just officials doing Arsenal
Read this
http://talkingsoccer.blogspot.com/2008/04/ref-apologisies-to-arsenal-boss.html
I do not buy the overachieve crab. I believed Wenger has attempted to battle for trophies from the very start of the season. I believe in him. I expect we push all the way until the end of the season. I believed we will reach at least 1 cup final. I believed we will win a trophy, even if it was the Carling Cup.
Of course we will now end up in empty hands and very likely to finish in the 3rd place. Slightly better than our position in last year. I am frustrated to no end. Pls Mr Wenger, splash out some money for some quality players.
agree with the analysis though not all costed our game this very night
my take on 'defining moments of this particular game...
* i thought almunia did away with his ill timed dash out of his goal line BUT old habit dies hard- and with a defender (can't recall) covering the high ball which would have gone out for a goal kick anyway, almunia had to dash out and made a poor kick for a liverpool throw which eventually caused the corner through which we conceded the 1st goal -- TOTOALLY avoidable
* Senderos did commit two mistakes, costly one unfortunately in this case! Why couldn't he learn from his 1st half mistake, and stuck close to Torres; if you watched it again, there're many seconds when Torres turned, set the ball up before pulling the trigger... and all this time, Senderos was, let's say, pondering and glued to the same spot several feet away from torres
* Why was Senderos getting a yellow on a rather benign looking challenge (his 2nd foul of the night) when Mascherano committed persistent, and i mean at least a dozen, fouls and still happily jumping around?? Ref, please comment.
* we CANNOT say we lacked experience for losing the 3rd goal! Regardless of [poor] ref decisions, what the heck Toure got all over Babel's back in the 18 yard box, knowing for 84 mins this ref was 'strict' [well, at least towards arsenal players... perhaps he had high expectation of us!], and Toure is one of our most experienced defender! And this also had nothing to do with playing RB, just vanilla defending; plus, Gallas's already waiting for the swaying (left,right, center) Babel so why oh why he didn't back off?
* Adebayor was poor, and still would not change my view that he's at best a squad player, albeit a useful one. He missed a sitter with plenty of time and space and what did he do? He didn;t even hit the target! Must have watched too much the replay of our CL final and focusing on Henry...
* I thought Wenger did well to intro Walcott... i feel if Walcott started his pace wouldn;t have been so apparent whereas in the last 10/ 15 mins, liverpool players couldn't be as fresh/ pacy any longer and thats probably how he got pass so many, other than good skills of course.
* Refs wanted respect... they better bloody earn it and based on recent live [arsenal ones at least] games i watched, sweet dream for these refs!
Again Wenger has underacheived in Europe. With all his great teams he has only achieved one final(Am an Arsenal fan btw). I love our football and I love Wenger but I feel I have had enough of him. He can keep deluding himself but I wont.
I wont talk about the ref Liverpool are a poor team, we made them look like mugs for 30 mins and then we bottled it. Wenger refusal to spend money meant the likes of Cesc, Hleb, Flamini and Ade were burnt out towards the end of the season. The likes of Senderos and Eboue should not be playing for Arsenal.
If Wenger doesnt buy a worldclass centre back I really dont know when our next trophy will come from. What pains me more than anything is knowing that Wenger will not change his methods and will yet again refuse to buy established players whilst Liverpool, Chelsea and United continue buying the best world players!
An Arsenal fan who has had enough of Wengerball
People seem to forget that after the double win in 98, we went three years without winning a trophy. Then look what happened. I trust wenger and it'll be a sad day when he goes.
Arsenal are the biggest bunch of cry babies in the league.
You didnt dominate anything outside of the 1st 30 minutes , please stop lying as us neutral fans watched the game too..
after the 1st 30 minutes Liverpool began to dominate and it shows.
Arsenal cant defend so stop blaming the refs its aprt and football u win some decisions u lose some decisions.
Rather than blame the ref 4 the penalty blame Toure because he and the other defender brought him down end of whether u wanna believe it or not.
Liverpool put 5 past ur so called superior team. In order to score 5 Liverpool must be able to play football too...thats just basic common sense..
Arsenal fans need to accept for all your pointless pretty boy football your defence is crap and all that pretty football has got you f**k all for trohpies and your out of everything my early April
Stop blaming refs and everyone else for ur failure to win a trophy since before HD T.V came out.
When will arsene learn? He just wont - even after 10 years.
Picking on Wenger shows no knowledge of football at all! He is the one that created this club! Not just this team but the whole club! It's his vision that created the state of the art training ground and the stadium! And all done winning trophies along the way. His team is a young team playing fantastic football built with very limited funds. Surely he made mistakes. I trust noone else to get it right. Liverpool have spent 230 million and they needed refereeing decisions to go through! Arsene knows!
Agree with you stephanos but surely one can still criticise Wenger can't he?
does anyone remember flamini at left back taking us through to the CL final - football is not so simple.
when will you learn you're not the arsenal boss?
when will you learn wenger IS the arsenal boss... and for a reason?
when will you learn that wenger got it spot on, as we outclassed AC Milan, twice, and in my honest opinion outclassed Liverpool twice too?
when will you learn that Arsene Wenger is not a scape goat, nor can he be held responsible for shocking refereeing decisions?
when will you learn that while you're ranting and raving at him for sloppy decisions... not only did we outplay liverpool, but only 8 months ago Arsenal were written off for even finishing 4th... and now, the spell which largely/arguably started from a terrible couple of decisions at birmingham (the penalty that never was, and the non penalty that was!), we're unlucky not to be closer to the top, if not top itself, than we are?
when will you learn that we love arsenal, and what arsene wenger has done for the club?
so... before you go off on one, spouting crap about wenger and the lads again... forget about learning, and think about what Wenger has TAUGHT arsenal, and us, about the way football can be played in such amazing style
Wenger does watch theo day in day out maybe he rerally isn't ready for a full game. He really takes the piss out of the opposition when he comes on later. Wenger did enough with his selections considering the players missing. The decisions went against us. we have to move on. Next year we will win the league no question. Last year we were 21 points behind the mancs. In the summer they spent 52 million PLUS loaned Tevez. If Wenger doesn't know what he's doing how the fuck has he managed to close the gap even with our injuries.
It is very painful that things turned out this way. Looks like another trophyless season to me and all gooners are hurting thus some of the rash comments. These crazy ranting will probably go on till the end of the season depending on the run of things in the premier league, but in the end all gooners will still come back to back wenger and his boys. why? for me its simple: i, like many others started supporting arsenal not because of titles but because of the kind of football they play. it's a beauty to watch! Funny enough i became a full-fledged gunner in the final of a cup match which arsenal lost after taking the lead and squandering so many unbelievable chances. We always come back in the end. Gunner for life(well as long as the football is pretty)
I do agree though that some things have not turned out as wenger might have expected and maybe he should have made certain changes. like eboue in midfield has not been a success and walcott should really start before him. But i think eboue is receiving too much stick, i mean we all know the guy was a great right back...maybe he should just go back there to support sagna! and wenger should really have strengthened the squad because it was totally inevitable that the players were going to get worn out.
I must say the composure of Arsenal was quite disapointing. As a Liverpool fan i must admit the Arsenal's claim to a pen in the first leg was more of a given than liverpool's penalty. However, i felt that liverpool always had the psychological edge over Arsenal and the tactical genius that Rafa is only further proved that on big occasions wenger just doesn't cut it! Arsenal epitomise the so-called 'beuatiful game', however you must win when and that's where Arsenal come short! Oh well maybe next year guys, maybe you'll get an easier run in to the final...
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